Poll
Question:
Do you like this?
Option 1: yes
votes: 3
Option 2: no
votes: 4
so basically, ws has always had a bad economy, mainly because of dupers, but I have a way to make money worth something now.
step 1 - add a shop in lumby that only buys skilling items (i.e. logs, rune ess, ores, etc).
step 2 - remove the ability to sell items to any shop ingame for money
step 3 - remove all money in game
step 4 - let people gain resources that have not been duped and sell to the shop = money
this completely works around the idea of an economy reset, and it gives some incentive to skill! And since ores are harder to mine than rune ess, you would need to make their price levels for when you sell them to the shop according to time taken to gain.
thank you very much, have at it everyone. Ideas?
you need no money
and why we should have money worth anything?
you trade now stuff for stuff nothing wrong with it i think.
And why add an shop?
buy from other people there are an few skillers
essence and stuff like that worth anything for some people who skill
only not money way
My answer to everything you just said is convenience
Nate, I don't support the idea of purchasing items that are required for skilling through gold coins honestly.
Firstly, this would also require a cash reset which many would oppose leaving a deadlock. Secondly, despite gold being what it should be, an item used to purchase stuff, it's a very unbalanced item in-game.
Lastly, I might be completely blind, although what I see going on is a lack of trade due to many factors that have to be handled first.
Quote from: Dug on August 01, 2013, 12:37:10 PM
Nate, I don't support the idea of purchasing items that are required for skilling through gold coins honestly.
Firstly, this would also require a cash reset which many would oppose leaving a deadlock. Secondly, despite gold being what it should be, an item used to purchase stuff, it's a very unbalanced item in-game.
Lastly, I might be completely blind, although what I see going on is a lack of trade due to many factors that have to be handled first.
You could also trade people for the items, this way just makes another medium of trade. Also i do not understand why you care about a cash reset? No one does anything with cash to begin with, and it would just open up a use for it. There is no way to keep everyone happy and fix the economy completely. it will never happen unless everyone is ok with a complete game reset. What you do not understand is that with the addition of a cash currency in the game, people will finally have an idea about how much items are worth, and which rares are worth more. There will finally be some kind of stability to trade. But I totally understand if you want to keep your max cash that does nothing.
Quote from: nate on August 01, 2013, 12:49:18 PM
You could also trade people for the items, this way just makes another medium of trade. Also i do not understand why you care about a cash reset? No one does anything with cash to begin with, and it would just open up a use for it. There is no way to keep everyone happy and fix the economy completely. it will never happen unless everyone is ok with a complete game reset. What you do not understand is that with the addition of a cash currency in the game, people will finally have an idea about how much items are worth, and which rares are worth more. There will finally be some kind of stability to trade. But I totally understand if you want to keep your max cash that does nothing.
Delete all the cash in the game -> sell the 2.1b amount dharoks we all have.
Either way money will be worthless, It'd turn into another currency for rared. That's it. You'd never see anyone going around saying "100k for Dharoks?" or any item like that.
Quote from: nate on August 01, 2013, 10:39:57 AM
step 2 - remove the ability to sell items to any shop ingame for money
why you no read jake?
Quote from: Jake on August 02, 2013, 09:09:58 PM
You'd never see anyone going around saying "100k for Dharoks?" or any item like that.
That doesn't nullify that point of his post. It would only be used for rares which isn't how an economy works. It's supposed to be used for everything.
Quote from: Krest I V on August 02, 2013, 10:30:02 PM
Quote from: Jake on August 02, 2013, 09:09:58 PM
You'd never see anyone going around saying "100k for Dharoks?" or any item like that.
That doesn't nullify that point of his post. It would only be used for rares which isn't how an economy works. It's supposed to be used for everything.
thanks krest. finally a supporter... you would think more people would want a better economy at no expense to themselves.
How could it be used for anything else other than rares? Practically every item, excluding the ones recently added, has been duped. Either way, money reset or not, the economy is wrecked. The only thing that could be strengthened in this could be the rare side, which isn't the economy. It's a small part.
Oh, you took that as me supporting it? Sorry, but that isn't the case. I think that if there were normal amounts of things like Dh gear, whips, pumpkins, etc. then this would be a good idea because it could be used to buy normal things like that, but since it would only be used on rares (and not very much either) then it becomes almost pointless.
alright so tell me whats the harm in resetting money? please save yourself from looking like an idiot and read my first post fully.
There's no harm in it, but there's no point in it either.
It'd be the most useless update/change. There's no advantages, something could be worked on that could actually be useful with the time it would take to make all this possible.
it harms nothing, and it would at least give an optional trade route. And as for the time consumed making this? little to none. its removing an item from the game, and adding a shop, and making shops not able to buy stuff. idk if you have ever coded before, but its not a big deal. plus, i dont know why either of you are making a big deal of it. jake afks when hes on and I have never ever seen krest online. I might be mistaken if you have a different account though.
Just because it doesn't harm anything doesn't mean it benefits us either. In other words, there's a very real possibility that it could not change the gameplay at all because of how little it would alter our messed up economy. You can't change an economy from being run on rares to being run on GP.
Quote from: nate on August 03, 2013, 12:53:42 AM
it harms nothing, and it would at least give an optional trade route. And as for the time consumed making this? little to none. its removing an item from the game, and adding a shop, and making shops not able to buy stuff. idk if you have ever coded before, but its not a big deal. plus, i dont know why either of you are making a big deal of it. jake afks when hes on and I have never ever seen krest online. I might be mistaken if you have a different account though.
I didn't say that it would take a long time to do this idea, not as if it is going to get done, but for the time it does take they could use it on making something that benefits the game. I have coded before, not as if it it's relevant to the post. As for the "Jake afks when hes on", I don't come on the game unless I'm playing it. IF I so happen to need to do something whilst I'm logged in, heaven forbid, I'll log out until I'm finished doing it then I'll log back in.
Not once have I seen you online so your assumptions are useless and miss-placed.
im on all the time.... unless you have a different time zone than me.
As if it were relevant, I see both of you on all the time and talk with both of you regularly.
reguardless, with the addition to the of the skills shop, it would encourage others to gain money who want to skill. Idk what yall are talking about, but there is no economy. Atleast this will add some kind of stability
There is an economy, it's just not good. In fact highly poor.
I can't see how this could add any stability what so ever, this does nothing.
it actually makes money something that isnt duped. i dont understand why you cant accept it. why is anything worth anything in this game? because people believe it. All we need to do is do a cash reset and follow all my steps and then tell people that money is a currency. simple economics.
Quote from: nate on August 03, 2013, 02:19:26 AM
it actually makes money something that isnt duped. i dont understand why you cant accept it. why is anything worth anything in this game? because people believe it. All we need to do is do a cash reset and follow all my steps and then tell people that money is a currency. simple economics.?
Why can't you accept that this idea isn't going to fix the economy? It'll just be another item(s) to trade for rares. That doesn't strengthen the economy at all. That does nothing for the economy. It's as useful as introducing another rare, really.
alright so if you were going to buy a beret from someone, its really dumb to say its worth about 1k rouge sets. with the introduction of gp into the economy as a viable and stable set of values to items. people will finally have a grasp on worth rather than guessing based on how much they like/dont like an item. now a beret will be worth 10m. that is a concept that everyone can grasp, not just the people who have played since the dawn of time and know what every little item is worth based off other items. Remember that we WANT players to stay on this server, not confuse them. I never said it would fix the economy, it would just make it a reasonable trading system.
Let's say for a second that we implement this to the game. What is GP going to be worth the first week? It'll be worth quite a bit and some rares will go for very little gp. But what happens a month into the game with this new system? GP is worth a lot, lot less. Something that went for 10m when GP was valuable is now worth max cash because at this point enough skilling items have been produced to decrease the value of GP. A year into the game with this system? Anyone that wants it can get max cash fairly easily and GP is back to being useless.
Not to mention that they've brought up that they're possibly thinking of adding more rares. How would this system work if they did that? The first couple of weeks the rares would go for 15m. Then the month after it would sell for 500k.
You're saying that people are making their own prices for their rares. How does this possibly fix that problem at all? Lets put this in perspective. Person A has a beret and Person B wants to buy that beret. Person A says that he wants 5m when Person B heard that they're worth 2m. Person C comes along and says they're worth 20m.
It doesn't solve the problem at all. RSPS economy rares sell of the people who owns them judgement.
I think the best solution is to let people spawn items.
Alright, so lets play the what if game. what if this was implimented? what if money is unstable for the first month? HOW ABOUT YOU LOOK AT HOW RUNEREBELS STARTED. zero cash ingame during day one, cash flow increases, cash flow continues to increase. The first month would be a little unstable, but don't you think people would realize that its really dumb to sell things for cash during this huge cash influx? You cannot condemn the idea just because it involves the process that every growing economy goes through at one point in time. as for the implementing of new rares, this effects it in no way. so what if there are new items? This money will have no effect in any way on the economy as long as people wait out buying and selling for the first month at least (which is easy considering no one actually sells things ever). As for the huge influx, who says the shop that people sell to has to give back alot of money? It could be like 10gp for each pure ess, or 50gp for each coal. try getting 10m that way. it will take a large amount of time for anything to change in price.
Let's use tokkul.
Better yet, let's not do this.
I still think letting people spawn items is the best solution.
Spawning max cash is only slightly faster than earning it through this method would be.
No but this way you can spawn everything then no one can control prices :)
Quote from: Krest I V on August 03, 2013, 02:57:26 PM
Spawning max cash is only slightly faster than earning it through this method would be.
Krest, you should read all the posts before you post. For the time being, the only valid arguments have been between me and jake. Even krypt's posts can be debated more involved than yours. so please, don't post unless you have an original idea, or actually know what you are talking about.
I have a better idea than being able to spawn items:
delete all items from game and any method of obtaining any items whatsoever. The game will have no items at all, so there's no way anyone can control prices of items because there won't be any! Because with spawning items, people might not know the name/id of the item and then they can control the price of the name or id in exchange for other item names/id's. But this way, there is absolutely no controlling prices.
Quote from: nate on August 03, 2013, 11:14:11 PM
Krest, you should read all the posts before you post. For the time being, the only valid arguments have been between me and jake. Even krypt's posts can be debated more involved than yours. so please, don't post unless you have an original idea, or actually know what you are talking about.
Not only have I read them all, but unlike you I can actually comprehend what they say. Kane has been making a joke out of this topic, because this is a joke, and I've actually given real input. Jake and I can only repeat ourselves so many times before it becomes irritating to respond to you making the same remark over and over again. Not sure how many people have to say it or how many times they have to say it, but I'll put it in bold for you.
This idea isn't beneficial to the community and it would be pointless to add it into the game. Now that's not to say I haven't made a terrible suggestion on here a dozen times, but when people tell me it's not a good suggestion I listen to what they have to say and don't fight to have an update added to the game that no one would like.
I usually take criticism fairly well, but not when it is from incompetent wannabes.
And as for comprehending posts, lets see all the fails.
1)Quote from: nate on August 03, 2013, 12:42:34 PM
As for the huge influx, who says the shop that people sell to has to give back alot of money? It could be like 10gp for each pure ess, or 50gp for each coal. try getting 10m that way. it will take a large amount of time for anything to change in price.
Quote from: Krest I V on August 03, 2013, 02:57:26 PM
Spawning max cash is only slightly faster than earning it through this method would be.
2)Quote from: nate on August 01, 2013, 12:49:18 PM
You could also trade people for the items, this way just makes another medium of trade. Also i do not understand why you care about a cash reset? No one does anything with cash to begin with, and it would just open up a use for it.
Quote from: Krest I V on August 03, 2013, 01:02:45 AM
Just because it doesn't harm anything doesn't mean it benefits us either. In other words, there's a very real possibility that it could not change the gameplay at all because of how little it would alter our messed up economy. You can't change an economy from being run on rares to being run on GP.
3)Quote from: nate on August 02, 2013, 10:28:24 PM
step 2 - remove the ability to sell items to any shop ingame for money
Quote from: Jake on August 02, 2013, 09:09:58 PM
Delete all the cash in the game -> sell the 2.1b amount dharoks we all have.
Either way money will be worthless, It'd turn into another currency for rared. That's it. You'd never see anyone going around saying "100k for Dharoks?" or any item like that.
Alright, so i know the 3rd one wasn't you, but it shows that people don't read. I think Jake has backed out of this conversation wisely because he knows he has made his point, that we had a good debate, and that we are both stubborn people. You on the other hand decided to stay to not only continue to argue your opposing viewpoints, but you also decided to stay and change this to a debate on speculation and integrity.
So considering your last post was a blanket statement, my rebuttal will be according. You are wrong, the economy could use
another alternate form of trade. "pointless" would mean that no one would use it, which would be terribly wrong. If this were implemented I guarantee people would use it, and eventually everyone once the cash flow settled.
As a word of advice from an older player to another, in the future, don't argue an update for a game you do not even play. You only post on the forums and apparently through the lack of reading done on your part according to this post of mine, you are not even good at that.
Thank you, someone please lock this, the original debate is done and over, this is now "pointless" peer speculation.
Nate, Krest I V is probably the most active player here on Worldscape. Just to clear all your accusations, he is actually Sad Panda (Ranked 4th overall) As a friendly suggestion i'd recommend getting your facts straight before making assumptions like that otherwise it will just blow back in your face and make you look silly. He's been around longer than you also and if he had added all his posts up, from his other accounts and what not, he'd have well over 20,000+ posts. Not as if that's relevant.
Also, for future reference, if you make a suggestion don't act as sourly as you did towards other people who are voicing their own opinion. They have every right to do so, within reason of course. Your negative attitude ever since you've come back isn't getting you anywhere and i'm 100% if it continues you'll most likely end up somewhere that you do not want to be. So i'd quit while you're ahead.
Locked by request.